If Britain had not let the Muslims in, it would not have had this problem. They certainly had no trouble barring millions of Hong Kong Chinese who wanted to flee the PRC. What harm would that have done to Britain? Improved the food? Brought in a hard-working middle class, striving population into a somnolent socialist Disneyland?

bart;

I think your last sentence answers the question. Lords of a Welfare State want clients, not citizens.

funny enough, it was the tories, in the 1950's, who opened up the u.k. to widespread immigration. the usual reason given is to provide low cost labor.

cjm:

The problem isn't that there are immigrants but that the natives aren't British anymore.

OJ, you short shrift the cohesive effects of shared history and culture. Religion, like language, is just one aspect of culture.

No, it isn't.

Yes, it is. Perhaps (perhaps) the most important aspect, but nonetheless an aspect. Religion does not equal culture. Religion can be bigger than culture only in the sense that it can be cross-cultural. But within a given culture ... indeed, within a given individual ... religion is but one aspect of "meaning".

We should probably just agree to disagree on this.

So it's not in fact "just one aspect." We agree to agree.

I hereby withdraw the "just". Good enough for a bureaucrat emeritus.

According to various sources, there are about 1.6 million Muslims in Great Britain and 4 to 6 million Muslims in the United States. Muslims make up a greater percentage of the British population than the American population, but in sheer numbers we got 'em beat. Various sources also estimate that in ten years or so there will be more Muslims in America than Jews.

Have a nice day.

maha:

And as well assimilated as Jews are, just as Europe never assimilated its Jews.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that Muslim assimilation will proceed any more smoothly here than elsewhere. Pakistanis born in America are every bit as retrograde as their parents, if not more.

It has. They're no harder to assimilate than Jews were.

oj,

Which of course coming from Whitebread New Hampshire where there is nobody darker than Audrey Hepburn, you can speak about with absolute certitude.

Reality isn't subjective, no matter how important people like you and Harry think you are.

I hear Tony Blair wants UK Muslim community leaders to condemn all forms of terrorism… His friend Tom Friedman just wrote an article in the New York Times suggesting “solutions to this Muslim problem” such as having Arab teenagers wear T-shirts with anti-terrorist statements on them!

“Terrorism” is certainly a despicable activity…but masochistic self-incrimination isn’t much higher on the moral scale.

After 1944, a certain lobby literally harassed the Vatican and the French government (using guilt by association and other Pharisaic scare tactics) for nearly four decades until they finally got what they wanted: sheepish “repentance” for crimes neither the Catholic Church nor the French government ever committed.

Today, the likes of B-LIAR, Friedman, Wolfowitz, Perl, Cheneybusharielsharon & Co. want Arabs and Moslems to “atone” for sins committed by others! That’s…how shall I say? … err…kind of grotesque to use a polite word!

We should all condemn the tragic events that took place in London yesterday, but Arabs and Moslems shouldn’t forget to put things into perspective: in the past 14 years, British and American pilots flew thousands of illegal “sorties” over Mosul, Baghdad, and Tickrit, bombarding methodically Iraq’s civilian and military infrastructure: hundreds of schools, hospitals, factories were burned.

More than 90% of the country’s water treatment plants and sewage trunk lines were destroyed by Tony Blair and his “brave” Tornado top guns: according to official UN figures, more than 500,000 Iraqi children died of malaria and dysentery as a direct consequence of US and British air strikes cum illegal invasion and occupation of a country that posed no threat to the West (whether “imminent” or otherwise): that’s 10,000 times more than the number of commuters who died in London yesterday…yet these innocent Arab boys and girls got 10,000 times less media coverage in the Times, the Telegraph, the BBC, and other “civilized” news outlets.

You see I’d rather wait for the Brits to do a little introspective atonement first. Then, I would expect them to write blood-lettered excuses on their chest: all of the UK’s T-shirt factories will have to work at full capacity for years before Maryam and other murdered Iraqi baby girls can finally rest in peace.

Yes, thank God, Bush and Blair put a stop to the inhuman bombing and sanctions.

It's nice that we allow the inmates at Gitmo to have Internet access.

Excuse me, I have to go flush a Koran down the toilet now.

[I]n the past 14 years, British and American pilots flew thousands of [UN sanctioned] “sorties” over Mosul, Baghdad, and Tickrit, bombarding methodically Iraq’s civilian and military infrastructure: hundreds of schools, hospitals, factories were burned.

More than 90% of the country’s water treatment plants and sewage trunk lines were destroyed by Tony Blair and his “brave” Tornado top guns: according to official UN figures, more than 500,000 Iraqi children died of malaria and dysentery as a direct consequence of...

Saddam Hussein's stupidity, insanity, and self-aggrandizement.

It was always within Saddam's power to stop the bombing raids, and the '03 U.S./UK invasion, as well as save the children.

However, he apparently didn't feel that it was a priority.

Luckily Bush and Blair did.